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The doctors say she is too old for surgery and recommend she be placed into hospice and wait to die. She otherwise healthy and of sound mind. Any recommendations and what should we expect?
The original message was cut down for some reason. The woman was in her 90s and had fallen, breaking her hips or legs on both sides. One doctor had said she was old, so surgery was too risky.
My father had lung cancer, severe COPD, and Alzhiemer's. He was in his late seventies when he broke his hip in a fall. They did the hip surgery on him, but he never woke up after surgery (he died the day following surgery). Sometimes it seems the medical doctors are caught between a rock and a hard place -- if they do surgery, the patient may not recover; if they don't do surgery, the quality of life would suffer drastically. I am sorry for your situation ... I recommend a second opinion and I would insist on knowing why surgery is not recommended.
Peachie - this must be so difficult for you. So what would you want a treatment to do? Have you spoken with an the nephrologist who evaluated your mom? Kidney disease is usually considered a chronic condition rather than a terminal disease and that can make a big difference in what can be done. Has she been on a diaylsis ? Are her kidneys doing any filtration at all? At some point, there is nothing that can be done. It sounds like your mom has other issues as she has really no mobility and can't stand on her own so she likely has circulatory issues too. What is her cognition like....can she accurately determine pain levels and where pain is? All these are factors that the doc's are using to evaluate her.
Realize that organ or any inner-cavity surgery is considered very invasive with low recovery after 60 days for the advanced elderly that is why it's not usually done. Plus the anaethesia risk, if you can even find an anesthesiologist who will do a very elderly patient. This is very very different than orthopedic surgery for hip replacement or bone repair (my mom had rotor cuff surgery).
My mom is about your mom's age and she could not withstand an invasive procedure (the surgery would likely be fine but she would die in recovery) and she is still able to stand and walk about with a walker and go to potty.She is in a NH and pretty cognitive as she has Lewy Body Dementia. Nevertheless, paperwork has been filed via an AD - advanced directive - that nothing is to be done surgery or transfusion wise for her and her hospice group has been selected so when the day comes that her gerontologist thinks that is appropriate, hospice gets called. No drama, no meeting, just move her onto the final phase. For your mom, the doc's want her in a hospice program as they feel they cannot do anything for her as their practice is geared to curing and healing and in their opinion that is not going to happen. Hospice is all about comfort care but realize that if she is on hospice (which Medicare pays for), there will be no payment made for any doctor appointments or medical evaluations or treatments that could possibly "cure" her. Surgery would be considered a cure and not allowed under hospice. She can only see the doc's within hospice. Contact and speak with hospice so that you an understand what's involved and why.
But keep in mind, that if she is on hospice and you do other care for her - like you find a surgeon to do surgery - that Medicare could deny the claim and you or whomever signed her into the hospital can be made financially responsible.
((((((Peachie)))))) Have you trusted this doctor all along? If you question his opinion, can you consult another doctor?. Without knowing anything more, it does seem that you mother has declined to the point where more treatment is not an option. Has she expressed any views on what the doctor has said? Hospice care will see that she is as comfortable as possible. She is a good age. My mother had hip surgery at 99, but her pre-op tests showed that she was in A1 condition, and she has survived it well. This is not the case with your mother. It is a hard when doctors say there is nothing more they can do. We always hope for the best, and that this problem can be fixed too, but eventually the time comes when it can't. I honestly think that hospice is the best option for your mum. Let us know how it all unfolds. I saw from your profile that you have several difficult things to deal with - brother, husband as well as your mother. (((((((((((((hugs))))))))))))) Joan
The doctor has told my 96 year old mother she has stage four kidney disease. The doctor says she would not be able to stand the treatment. She has lost most of her sight to glacoma and she now is too weak to walk with her walker. She can only stand a short while. The doctor has put her on hospice care. Should she still get some treatment for the kidney condition?
Is this surgery to remove a tumor in the brain that hasn't affected her cognition yet? Cancer surgery? Hip repair? You say that she is otherwise healthy -- other than what? What kind of surgery is it that her doctor thinks she is "too old" for? And how old is she?
Mother has a hip repair at 99, and, now, at 100 walks with a cane, and may not always need that. I wonder what surgery your g'ma need. I would recommend a second opinion.
My mother had very successful hip surgery at 101. She is now 103 and walks fine with a walker. Waiting to die should not be an option for her. Seems like there is nothing to lose in having surgery. Rena
What a terrible predicament. She is old, but I don't know if anyone is too old to have their bones fixed. Perhaps they can stabilize in another way. I would seek a second opinion as well as calling hospice. The second opinion is just to get an idea on what might make her more comfortable in her time here.
By proceeding, I agree that I understand the following disclosures:
I. How We Work in Washington.
Based on your preferences, we provide you with information about one or more of our contracted senior living providers ("Participating Communities") and provide your Senior Living Care Information to Participating Communities. The Participating Communities may contact you directly regarding their services.
APFM does not endorse or recommend any provider. It is your sole responsibility to select the appropriate care for yourself or your loved one. We work with both you and the Participating Communities in your search. We do not permit our Advisors to have an ownership interest in Participating Communities.
II. How We Are Paid.
We do not charge you any fee – we are paid by the Participating Communities. Some Participating Communities pay us a percentage of the first month's standard rate for the rent and care services you select. We invoice these fees after the senior moves in.
III. When We Tour.
APFM tours certain Participating Communities in Washington (typically more in metropolitan areas than in rural areas.) During the 12 month period prior to December 31, 2017, we toured 86.2% of Participating Communities with capacity for 20 or more residents.
IV. No Obligation or Commitment.
You have no obligation to use or to continue to use our services. Because you pay no fee to us, you will never need to ask for a refund.
V. Complaints.
Please contact our Family Feedback Line at (866) 584-7340 or ConsumerFeedback@aplaceformom.com to report any complaint. Consumers have many avenues to address a dispute with any referral service company, including the right to file a complaint with the Attorney General's office at: Consumer Protection Division, 800 5th Avenue, Ste. 2000, Seattle, 98104 or 800-551-4636.
VI. No Waiver of Your Rights.
APFM does not (and may not) require or even ask consumers seeking senior housing or care services in Washington State to sign waivers of liability for losses of personal property or injury or to sign waivers of any rights established under law.
I agree that:
A.
I authorize A Place For Mom ("APFM") to collect certain personal and contact detail information, as well as relevant health care information about me or from me about the senior family member or relative I am assisting ("Senior Living Care Information").
B.
APFM may provide information to me electronically. My electronic signature on agreements and documents has the same effect as if I signed them in ink.
C.
APFM may send all communications to me electronically via e-mail or by access to an APFM web site.
D.
If I want a paper copy, I can print a copy of the Disclosures or download the Disclosures for my records.
E.
This E-Sign Acknowledgement and Authorization applies to these Disclosures and all future Disclosures related to APFM's services, unless I revoke my authorization. You may revoke this authorization in writing at any time (except where we have already disclosed information before receiving your revocation.) This authorization will expire after one year.
F.
You consent to APFM's reaching out to you using a phone system than can auto-dial numbers (we miss rotary phones, too!), but this consent is not required to use our service.
All these are factors that the doc's are using to evaluate her.
Realize that organ or any inner-cavity surgery is considered very invasive with low recovery after 60 days for the advanced elderly that is why it's not usually done. Plus the anaethesia risk, if you can even find an anesthesiologist who will do a very elderly patient. This is very very different than orthopedic surgery for hip replacement or bone repair (my mom had rotor cuff surgery).
My mom is about your mom's age and she could not withstand an invasive procedure (the surgery would likely be fine but she would die in recovery) and she is still able to stand and walk about with a walker and go to potty.She is in a NH and pretty cognitive as she has Lewy Body Dementia. Nevertheless, paperwork has been filed via an AD - advanced directive - that nothing is to be done surgery or transfusion wise for her and her hospice group has been selected so when the day comes that her gerontologist thinks that is appropriate, hospice gets called. No drama, no meeting, just move her onto the final phase. For your mom, the doc's want her in a hospice program as they feel they cannot do anything for her as their practice is geared to curing and healing and in their opinion that is not going to happen. Hospice is all about comfort care but realize that if she is on hospice (which Medicare pays for), there will be no payment made for any doctor appointments or medical evaluations or treatments that could possibly "cure" her. Surgery would be considered a cure and not allowed under hospice. She can only see the doc's within hospice. Contact and speak with hospice so that you an understand what's involved and why.
But keep in mind, that if she is on hospice and you do other care for her - like you find a surgeon to do surgery - that Medicare could deny the claim and you or whomever signed her into the hospital can be made financially responsible.
I wonder what surgery your g'ma need.
I would recommend a second opinion.