Hi all - I guess all I am looking for here is your opinion, and to help me see something I may be missing?
We have had FIL with us for 2 long years now (I know not as long as some of the troopers on this site), but long enough for me anyway... Hubby and myself do not get away often, but have decided we absolutely have to have a vacay, away, by ourselves. FIL is not mean like some I have read about, but is a narcissist, has PD and is a stroke patient. The last time we went out of town for a couple of days to visit MIL out of town (they are divorced), we vetted a wonderful AL care facility in our town. When I say vetted, I mean vetted... I went over there 4 different times, and even took him to visit and meet others prior to his stay. They matched him up with other residents who had similar interests, etc.
Afterwards, he tells hubby in private that next time he prefers to just stay home. Well, next time came, and I made hubby do all of the advanced meal prep. etc., that it took to try to be away for 2-3 days. I do the meds....
NOW, due to increased risk of falls, etc., and the length of time, he absolutely cannot stay home. We cannot prepare enough meals in advance for him, and it simply does not make sense.
So hubs was pushing and pushing me to find a place to vacay, book it, and make the plan. Well I have, and it is 23 days away. I told hubs over a week ago that he needed to talk with his Dad about respite care at AL, or at least the alternative would be qualified, vetted "at home care", via a couple hours a day, or meals, etc.
Well here I am... waiting... I asked hubs yesterday if he had talk to FIL, he said yes, Dad would "think" about it, and let hubs know what he wanted to do... WHAT THE H_____. I had begged him not to give him a choice in the 1st place, but he just can't bring himself to make his Dad do anything he does not want to do. SO here we are..... I asked yesterday if FIL had said anything one way or the other.... nope nothing.
I had pre-arranged for a home health professional to come to the house to meet with him, make an assessment, etc., just in case that's what he decided. That was this morning. I cancelled the appt., I don't think it is fair to waste her time coming here, when he won't even make a decision.
I am going to pledge to myself, that I am NOT going to ask about this again... I am sure hubs will not want to miss a vacation, but he needs to realize that care decisions cannot be made at the last minute, and people are not just waiting in the wings to be called. I cannot believe he is just sitting here waiting for the King to make a decision. I am at the point that I almost wish it to be too late for find care/facility openings when and if he "does" decide, and I can enjoy a vacay right by myself.
Is it just me????!!!!
it may be chi,dish or immature on my part, but I feel like I have done the work, and made it clear that the FIL care is in his court. Now I wait.... I guess I just feel that if it is important enough to hubs he will figure it out. I know he truly wants, needs and deserves this vacay. However, like anything that directly involves in him having to address things he deems “uncomfortable” with his dad, he sidesteps, and refuses to have the conversation. This will be interesting because of the fact that he really wants to go away and was the advocate for pushing for it... that is the difference now. Other issues have been my asking hubby to discuss better hygiene, etc. hubs makes sure his dad’s meals and tea are Johnny on the spot, and I am thankful for that, unless he is working, then it’s me. I work from home, which is a Blessing, but not when you are living in what equates to a depressive encounter with FIL everything single day.... no breaks. I have offered and offered to arrange for senior days out or Silver Sneakers exercise.... nope.... now I know that he is Very very limited with use of his extremities and balance, and I do feel really bad for him, as he used to be so active....
anyway, did not mean to write a book in response to your response! It is therapeutic to get it off your chest, thanks!
I have never worked so hard to go on vacation in my life! No wonder we have not been in years.
So, the upshot is that I am not saying another word until hub asks his dad, again, what his preference is..... maybe a little childish on my part, but I am SICK of dragging everyone through making decisions. The man can barely decide what to watch on TV, so I hold no great hope that he will be forthcoming with a decision. I would image that time will not be on our side to secure a safe, acceptable solution - may be on vacation by myself...
Thank you so much for your feedback!
Does DH have POA for his Dad or is he still considered competent.?
Don't wait for something to happen because it isn't going to. "Like Father like son" and FIL doesn't have any skin in this game.
You have two choices. Confront FIL and tell him you will be contacting the AL place today and making reservations for the day before your departure. If he wants other arrangements he can make them himself (even if he is not capable and knows it)
Start making plans for the things you will enjoy doing on this solo vacation. Include things you know DH would enjoy and don't hide these plans.
Think of a friend or relative who also needs a break and would enjoy sharing the trip. If He/she is also a caregiver to a not very demanding loved one suggest they stay with DH and FIL while you are gone. That might just get DH to put his boots on PDQ.
FIL is still competent, but granted me full POA so that I could handle his affairs, etc. AND you are right, FIL has NO skin in the game - as long as he has his creaky-a____ recliner, remote, cookies, he's good.
This is quickly boiling down now - It is not going to be easy to find short-term respite care, and after much debate (with myself), I have made up my mind I don't want someone coming to the house that I don't know.... so this really leaves hubs with two options - either respite care outside the home, or he stays here too.
I have warned him that he is not to ask our grown son to stay here because he runs a business and is going crazy all day and some nights. Plus, this is NOT a real solution - FIL needs to understand that he cannot simply sit here and act like nothing is going on. How very selfish - I swear I believe if hubs told him that he would stay home from vacay because of these reasons, he would not blink....
So, like you said, I may be enjoying this one alone, or partially with our grown daughter, who is expecting in lives in the same coastal town where the vacay is planned.
And, you were totally right, like father like son...... sits around with their head in the sand, waiting for whatever, then gets mad if you plow ahead and make plans.... not this time. This is one of the FEW times that the end result does not really affect me, so therefore, waiting them out will be interesting.... I am NOT saying one more word about it - I want hubs to feel the heat.
Thanks for letting me rant!
While my FIL is not mean or evil, he is just apathetic, did not take care of his affairs, and thereby, not even thinking about his devoted son and grandchildren, a world class skirt chaser, and generally someone I have absolutely no respect for.
I am thankful for this forum and affirmation that I am not being childish in expecting hubs to step up here. It's always me, and that is only my fault. I have always been the "arrangement" maker. To be fair, hubs takes care of lots of other things, but this seems to be "my" area.
So I am proud of myself that I have not asked about whether he was talked to the "King", but once and that was Monday. His response was that the "King" would let him know.... Well we are T-22 days to leaving. I am holding strong that I am NOT going to ask again, and when the "magic" moment arrives, will not rush to action.... that too will be hubs to deal with. While I don't think hubs will let is come to his missing vacay, I can honestly say that I am OK with going by myself. I need it too....
Thank you again for "listening", and best wishes to you as well!
You are right on many counts, and I am SO sorry you have been working with this for 10 years!
You are right, it is "soul sucking" and only gets worse. I would dare to say that you may agree that, at the very least, it takes a really strong foundation to even contemplate taking on this long term task --- AND I don't have that.
We know that long term care will wipe him out completely with what little finance he has left, and we worry about what happens then; however, the toll it is taking on our lives cannot be measured, and I truly fear I may not be able to find my way "back" after all of this.
Sometimes the damage is just too great.
Stay tuned as I will update - but in the meantime, I am wishing you the best and asking for Blessings to come your way in your journey and much needed relief. Please take care of yourself!
Your husband is trying to respect both his father's feelings and his autonomy - his right to decide whether he'll stay in respite care or not. Check, check, quite right in principle. However. Your FIL, while his feelings must still be regarded, is passing the point at which he is capable of assessing a situation and making an informed choice about how to handle it; and at *that* point it is unfair to FIL to place responsibility for the decision on him. If DH really wants to treat his father kindly he shouldn't put him in that position.
In your place, I think I would get DH and FIL in the same room and paying attention and tell, not ask, them about the assessment. Book and proceed. If FIL has any substantial objection he can then speak up (and you must listen, just in case it is a valid one, though I can't offhand think what that might be); but the chances are he won't.
Start the process, let it run, assume FIL is going into respite and DH is going with you; and with any luck you'll find that FIL prefers to comply (and grumble about it, but that's okay, he's allowed) than to go to the trouble of resisting.
DH doesn't want to be high-handed with his Dad and I respect that. But when it starts to become impractical and onerous for all of you, it's time to adjust.
FIL simply does not want to (not that I would either, really) acknowledge that he no longer is the strong athlete he once was, and that falling, etc., would be lethal.
I know this, I cannot continue to get myself so worked up about this, this task really is in hub's court and he wanted it that way.... So, I guess we will see what he does with is.
I may be on a solo-vacation, but I think will need it!
Stay tuned, and thank you again for your outreach and time!
It is sad that hubs cannot see that all of this unnecessary added stress, makes vacationing not so much fun. When you are exhausted (mentally) by the time you get there, what's the point! LOL
Stay tuned!
To keep yourself from sitting there on your thumbs wondering when the hell hubs might wake up...I would make the AL reservation, have it ready. Tell hubby and say "here are your choices": tell (not ask - as it’s your home and vacay) dad that we are leaving on this date and you will be staying back at AL place or the other option is he can stay home with dad and you will be going. That at least puts the elephant in the room out and visible and you can stop the cat and mouse game and get on with it. After you say that then wait and see what he does. Now it’s in his lap and he knows you’re serious and what your plans are. I would go without him in a heartbeat but I bet he will capitulate. Let us know what happens in the end.
You know one of the most sad parts of this whole thing is that my hubs is truly a wonderful man, but when it comes to his dad, and risking making him uncomfortable, all bets are off. They are two peas in a pod when it comes to hard and fast decision making, (one of the many things that drives me crazy about FIL). Honestly, when he was able to drive, I don't know how in the world he was able to decide whether to turn right or left out of the driveway.... Damn, lead, follow, walk beside or get the hell out of the way.
After much soul searching I have discovered that I am guilty of pushing to get things fixed, not only for the sake of it, which is my nature, but because I don't want to have to help solve/sort out in the end when everyone else is just standing around..... waiting...... for a fix. This is ONE of the rare cases that I actually do not have skin in the game and can ride this out. We decided where we wanted to go on vacay, and I took care of the rest; hubs part was to talk to FIL about respite care. He would usually be glad to let me do that too, except that he knows dad does not like the AL respite care option. Come to find out, part of that reasoning is because he thinks the others are too bossy and he is not in bad enough condition to be there (oh, wait, add delusional to the mix)..... I had asked hubs NOT to give him an option, but if he chose to do that, it was his call. In no uncertain terms I made it clear that our adult son who runs his own business and is crazy busy, is NOT an option for full time care. Stopping by, bringing a meal and checking on occasion is fine, but not for this length of time; hubs agreed, but I am concerned that may pop back up (holy war will break out if so)....
SO, on the back-end I have checked on a couple of AL respite care facilities, as well as home care, just so that I know what we are really dealing with. Which is a good thing because the parameters have changed since the last time he was there, # of day minimums, health requirements, etc. So I am keeping this "in the wings" until hubs gets his ass in gear. Last night, while out of ear-shot of FIL I just casually said, "so what's the final word"? He seemed a little surprised, shook his head and said FIL had not given an answer (can you believe this)! Passive aggressive on FIL's part.... Hubs started to say, "just go ahead and book a place", then cut himself off, and said, wait let me talk to him again.... I was proud of myself for saying nothing more than, well before you do, let's update so that you (hubs) has a little more info. Dinner served, they watched TV together as usual.... I went to bed, not a word. Done and Done.
Again, like you said, FIL is not running this house and does not have the right to call the shots on this. We are not trying to drop him off at a homeless shelter for heaven's sake. He is so selfish that he does not care that his son has to stress himself to death to pre-prepare meals/drinks, etc. for when we have been away for 1-2 days...
Let's hope and Pray that he either figures it out, does not and stays here, and DOES NOT involve our son as a last resort for dragging his feet and not having the necessary discussions.
As much as I love hubs, I can honestly say that in our 30 years this "thing" with his dad has done some serious damage to my respect factor. Ironic that the 1st big fuss we had was about FIL, and now here we are, full circle....
I will keep you guys posted, but in the meantime, please know how much your response and honest feedback means to me! This has been therapeutic to me, and I hope whatever you may be dealing with, improves as well. Thank you again! Stay tuned!
You are right, this particular task is his to do and he is squirming about it. So, I guess it will depend on just how much he wants to go on vacay. Like you said, I can always go by myself, and honestly that probably would do me a world of good.
Thank you again, and best wishes with the issues you may be dealing with.
Your house...your rules. (your husbands as well)
Tell FIL that you are going on a vacation. He has 2 choices
1. Someone to come in.
or
2. He goes to a "resort"
He has to choose. Give him a date that he has to give you an answer if he does not choose by that date you get to choose.
At some point you have to take options away and just make the decision as to what is best for everyone. Making choices can be difficult with dementia of any kind there can be a "fear" that the wrong choice will be made.
Keep in mind if you have your vacation planned and scheduled if he ends up going someplace they all may require certain medical tests before they accept him. So most likely he would have to have a TB test, up to date vaccinations so this may take time.
Enjoy your self.
You are SO right about pre-planning at respite AL care. As I have indeed come to find out TB tests are required (and thank you for bringing that up), as well as other physical updates, and analysis.
With that said, we are T-21 days from "leaving" and I don't think hubs understands that preparations have to be made now, this is not a vacay that it 6 months away....
I am prepare to go right by myself if necessary; however, if all goes on the path "they" normally take, it will be stressful right up until the last minute, then hubs will be in the car like a "puppy" happily awaiting the trip, and I will be tearing my hair out....
Stay tuned, and thanks again. Best wishes on what you may be dealing with!
We now aren’t talking with any of them and our lives are so less stressful. We know it won’t be like this forever, and we are enjoying it while we can. I set my boundaries with him & them, which gave him the strength to set his own. It was hard for me — very hard — to sit by & watch things deteriorate but I had to for my own well being. It’s like when as a parent we had to sit by watching our child suffer the consequences of a poor decision. I understand completely your dilemma.
You could go on the vacation & hubby could join you mid-way thru it. If he is anything like my husband, he could be secretly hoping (1) you make the decision for him or (2) you cancel the vacation. I, also, wouldn’t want anyone in my home while we weren’t there. Heck, I am here when my house gets cleaned by the lady who has been doing it for 15+ years.
Stay strong ... you are NOT being selfish or childish. sending you hugs.
i started preparing the information I had and asking him for more into in January 2017. Yes over one year ahead of time. After months and months of nagging all the documents were ready on time. I spent over 100 hours putting everything into order for the accountants.
When did he sign the papers? Last Saturday 6 months late. I have no idea how much his dilly dallying will cost in the end.
So my point is, plan to go on the trip on your own. Do not do any extra prep of meals meds etc for your fil and hubby before you leave. Have a wonderful time, relax, refresh and make sure you book your next trip as soon as you get back.
And no, you are not at all unreasonable to expect that your fil would be told this is where you will be while We go on holidays. It is all part of him being allowed to live with you.
Enjoy your holiday. If you have not traveled much on your own, you may find that you thoroughly enjoy travelling at your own pace. Not having to negotiate activities, meals etc can be quite pleasant.
Sometimes i I think it is easy for us to really start to wonder if we are sane?
I don’t mind going alone at all.... as much as I hate to admit it, after all that we have been through with this situation, I really was looking forward to reconnection, it now I just want peace and quiet, like you said, no meal negotiation or se. for that matter.... uterally alone with the beach, books and wine.
uncortunately I don’t think hubs will let that happen and his half baked care plan will be what he wants to go with, and “I” will be deemed the unreasonable one for not wanting to go along with it.
stay tuned...
oh oh and by the way, I don’t know how you did not strangle your brother..... don’t just you LOVE sweeping up everyone else’s messes when they just won’t get the job done?
Just a suggestion, it seems in my house nothing much gets done without seeing it in writing, both on my and DHs part. I guess we’re both kind of visual people, pretty organized and need our lists! I would suggest writing down a list of the potential ALs, with their phone numbers and all the requirements you’ve investigated. The last option on the list could be “I can go alone”, (as long as you’re really ok with that, cause he might choose it. And how would that really make you feel??) And hand it to DH. “Here you go, let me know what you guys decide.”
I did this with my kids, and explained it all to them. THIS is the line, cross it or do not, YOUR choice, but consider the consequences of that decision. Sometimes I have to do similar tactics with my mother when she has an appointment and starts whining she doesn't need/want to go.
I have seen so many people who make that line with their kids, and then like in the cartoons, keep drawing a new line, and another, and another. They then learn (you are teaching them!) to keep pushing, and it will get worse as kids get older (or brain functions decline in elders.)
ONE LINE. Hubs, do this, or I go alone. PERIOD. And STICK TO IT!
Also, I would go with the AL facility - add to hubs sand line that he has until X-DATE to make arrangements.
but us you are right, he does not even think about us getting in trouble if something should happen. How typical.... at this point I would rather just go alone
This is will just wear you out...
God Bless!
So so glad your sister was able to get away and things taking care of!
You are a saint of a DIL having gone above & beyond the call of duty. The guys are so lucky to have you on the team. I think they know it and appreciate it but they are after all "guys!"
I am impressed that Hubs is as involved as he is in his Dads care ....sounds like you all have a good system in place with you at the helm looking forward...anticipating future needs and decisions. Something a son doesn't necessarily want to face. I get it.
As others have suggested if you have the energy at this point (the 11th hour now!) to insist on an answer and yet again make the last minute arrangements so you and Hubs can get away together go for it. If not then let this be a lesson to all as you are walking out the door with love and regrets that you wish Hubs could join you. Tough love them...sometimes thats what it takes to drive the point home...or to the beach in this case!
Don't forget to send pics...some real good pics if you get my drift!! Enjoy with or without Hubs....you so deserve this......
Yep 11th hour and tired.... I feel that after I initalized the original discussion, came to the 2 possible solutions with hubs, let him take the lead on talking to his dad...... who has never responded by the way...... relaying updates with respect to added info., about our 2 agreed on solutions..... more silence...... I’m done.
Now the only problem is waiting it out, and standing in the face of the storm when hubs hatches his last minute, half-ass plan.... he will accuse me of just trying to make him stay behind because he is willing to bend the pre-agreed upon options just to make it happen... only because he will not engage and take the lead on pressing his dad. I am sick of backdoor “ non- solutions”....
thanks for for reading and taking the time for feedback
It's your home and your vacation and up to you to protect both. Having a stranger in your home comes with risks. It sounds like your FIL needs 24-7 care while you're on vacation. That is expensive and, if one does not show up, you have a problem. It's just not worth it. Make the decision for your FIL that he is going to respite stay for 30-days at the AL you liked. Period.
Avoiders get what they want because people allow them to avoid making a decision. My FIL is an avoider and my husband hates confrontation but has gotten better at being proactive; I am a fixer and believe it's better to be proactive than reactive.
so so when you have an avoider who comes up with a half-ass last minute decision regarding how to handle the this, all outing the burden on us, in order not to make the king uncomfortable, how do I handle that.
? Be glad I had to do nothing and let it go, or stand and insist that his “solution” are not acceptable? FIL can be alone, he just can’t prepare any meals, drinks, etc. fall issues are also a concern. Like I responded to another post, DH will try to make me feel that I am being unreasonable by not going along with whatever DH comes up with.... it is almost not even worth it when you spend a month in advance arguing about care for FIL! Hell, maybe they should go and leave me alone....
Leave a 'package' with staff of something for him that was 'sent' by you on
vacay [I put in diabetic chocolates for my mom] put on a return address label & fake a stamp with cancellation - this is to be given about 1/2 way through -
If hubby still won't co-operate then you go either alone or with a friend & send them both a postcard saying 'having a great time'
I am totally on board with the going it alone options, as I really need it. I don’t think DH will be too happy about that, but he should stand up and take the lead.... he just does not understand how this makes him look in my eyes....
But I also read you are the POA and not your husband. Is that correct? If so in the future I would not give either one of them choices or options on any decisions. You make the best one, make your announcement and carry on with life. That will hopefully eliminate this stress that you are going through now. Keep us posted! And Have fun in the sun!
POA issue.... will definitely give that some thought.
here is where I am.... DH would not be surprised that I can handle traveling alone as I know done so for business and family needs in the past.... the BIG difference here is that this is OUR planned vacation, that he pushed for incidentally. I do think he would be surprised that I would take off on “our” vacation alone. Honestly I think he will continue to avoid, and ride this out until the end, try to put together some inadequate “meal plan, etc” coverage for his dad and go. I don’t think he has or would even fathom now going. He knows full well the caviots with each possibility and that time is not on our side. I have shared only a tidbit of what I know about respite care at ALs since there have been recent changes, and reiterated that I was concerned about having people we don’t know come into the house while we are away..... he just takes it in and then nothing.
the upshot here is that I would place a bet that he will not go back to FIL and press - FIL is just happy to sit here and not be bothered, nor apparently care that his son needs a vacay, and is willing to participate in ruining it by his behavior..... also, and here is the biggie and what I would ask for feedback on,,,,, I project that DH will do nothing, and until the last minute and spring it on me that he is just going to do some make shift meal plan, ask our son to drop by a couple of times to check on FIL, and that’s about it..... I just don’t think this “path of least resistance” is acceptable, am I just looking to stand my ground on principle, or am I right that this just allows this to continue unless I step in and fix it, which I am not doing.
I would really like to get feedback on:
1). If DH comes with (and I bet he will); the half baked idea already described... do I just let him know I don’t agree and stay out of it, in order to avoid the epic fight that is going to take place when I tell him that I think he should not go with me because he did not make proper arrangements? The reason I ask.... because he will blow up if I suggest such a thing.... he will turn the tables and accuse of me just not wanting him to go, and that as long he does whatever he does in order to go, I should not take this kind of stand; which totally negates the original discussions of the only 2 acceptable choices, winging it was not one of the two.
i am so tired and annoyed that I really would rather go alone.... I really need it. I know it makes me sound like a whimp, and really it is more a matter of whether I want to start and all out wear over this,, DH is great at turning things to do with FIL as “me”; he will say “ why do you care as long as he is taking care of it”; why does it have to be one of the two choices? What he does not understand is that this back peddling and not taking real action to deal with his dad is sickening to me and truly puts a big dent in my respect for DH? Any thoughts? Thank you so much to all for listening and weighing in.
Keep your reservations and let hubby know that you will be going with or without him. But you’d much rather he join you. You’ll gain some sanity with your vacay.
I recently had to take a much needed break. I gave hospice and the AL my sisters phone number and advised everyone that I would not be answering my phone. Everyone else needed to handle dad and any issues during this time. (Aside from him passing of course). It worked! Everything was handled and I was able to regroup and come back with a renewed outlook on everything.
So go and enjoy. Life does not wait. Time keeps moving and you cannot get back lost time. Make sure that you take hubby’s phone while on your vacay or it will be ruined with calls about FIL.
Wishing you the best
After reading the other posts,
I agree with you. If your husband doesn't make a decision, he is sure you will. After all, you probably always have. Don't do it!!! You have said your piece, go for it. Save all the other good advice for next time, and be sure there is a next time. I am totally in your corner.