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My Dad will be going on medicaid soon. His house has been deeded over to my son for 4 years with one year remaining. Will we only have to pay the remaining value of one year?
I am also an elder law attorney. The difference between me and K. Gabriel Heiser, who answered above, is that he devoted time into researching the laws of all the states, while I only work in Pennsylvania. I am a good accountant, he is a good writer. I really do recommend his book. It has a money back guarantee, but I doubt you will return the book. I highly recommend that you read it before your appointment with an elder law attorney. Do you think an elder law attorney is going to force you to read a book before coming for an office visit? Of course not, or you might go to someone else. On the other hand, if you read the book you would be a much better client and get a lot more for your money.
The penalty period can extend beyond 4 years, even beyond 5 years! That depends on the value of the gift and the state's then-current "penalty divisor" (roughly equivalent to the average cost of a nursing home stay in the particular state). The calculation divides the gift value by the state penalty divisor, and the resulting number is the number of months' penalty, i.e., period of disqualification from receiving Medicaid. By waiting to apply for Medicaid at least 5 years from the date of a gift, that gift is no longer considered for Medicaid eligibility purposes.
There could be a four year penalty period. You need to meet with an attorney and then run the numbers on which option makes sense. It may be smarter financially for your son (since he receives the benefit of protecting your dad's estate) to pay for the care required for your Dad until the look-back period is up.
It's possible that a reverse mortgage could work in your situation, although it would be costly. But it could allow you to get the money to pay for the 12 months of Dad's nursing home care. Note that after the borrower/homeowner is absent 12 months from the home, the reverse mortgage must be repaid, so that's the farthest extent of time it could possibly buy you.
I would seriously suggest that you become an educated legal customer about the application before hiring anyone & I would call 2 or 3 medicaid law firms before meeting with them & ask alot of questions after looking over the application yourself with some local free help. At the very least you will know when the legal firm is padding the retainer to let you think it is harder to pass than usual. I found after their approval that whenever I called state caseworkers I could get immediate answers to simple questions that turned out accurate but when I called the law firm accountant that I got an inaccurate medicaid answer & that was the acct. that handled the app.
I went through a medicaid law firm near here to get my mom & dad approved for NH medicaid because they had an out of state piece of property. The retainer was $2,000.00. You can visit with the only lawyer at a medicaid legal firm as the initial consultation but in every case in the DFW area the application process from paying the retainer through to approval is handled only by a bookkeeper/acct. The bookkeeper/accountant is usually not as familiar with medicaid rules as a medicaid caseworker with the state. Once the law firm handles the app & submits to the caseworker it may need more work. All I know is in no cases of ANY med. law firms does a medicaid specialist or lawyer handle the app you have paid 2K retainer for. And there are some cases that do not need the lawyer. It sounds like you could use one but be careful to ask when choosing a firm to handle the app be sure to inquire who will actually be meeting with you, gathering the documents & actually filling out the app. I actually changed firms 3 times before choosing the one that applied & my demand by the 3rd firm was that I be present at the filling out of the actual application.
Another option to educate yourself before meeting with any firm is to call a local office of long term medicaid & ask how to obtain a blank application. Get at least 2 copies of the blank app. Look over it carefully yourself. Make calls for answers about the sections of the app, educate yourself about how YOU would fill it out. Then take in a rough draft you have filled out to a local advocacy office, like DADS in TX or senior source. Anywhere there is a benefits counselor. Sometimes the benefits counselor for free will know more than the lawyer.
If you apply for Medicaid now before the 5 years is up, Medicaid will consider the deeeding of the house to your son to be a gift and the value of the house will become a penalty against your father. So if Dad's house is worth $250,000 and the nursing homes in your state cost $5,000 a month your father will not be covered for about 50 months...4 years 2 months and you will have to pay for his care during this time.
If there was any way on God's green earth, that I could keep my father out of a NH for one more year, I would do it.....seek all options and run to see and Elder Law Attorney.
More specifically to answer the question, Medicaid uses an all-or-nothing calculation: if the gift was made within the five-year period preceding the date you apply for Medicaid, then the full value of the gift on the date it was made causes a penalty period. If it's over five years, then nothing is included towards a penalty.
Under pre-DRA (the Medicaid law change effective in 2006) law, the penalty did indeed go down each passing month starting with the date of the gift, but under current law it does not.
Unless one of the transfer exceptions apply (e.g., transfer to a Caregiver Child or disabled child), if your father applies for Medicaid before the 5-year lookback period has expired (i.e., more than 5 years from the date he signed the deed and it was recorded at the local register of deeds) he will be facing a VERY long penalty period! The number of months of such disqualification from receiving Medicaid coverage will be equal to the value of the house on the date of the gift divided by your state's average nursing home cost. Such average costs are published each year by each state; you can call your Medicaid department if you really need to know the figure, but to be safe you may wish to wait until AFTER the expiration of the 5-year lookback period. If you are still unsure, then be sure to consult with an elder law attorney in your state with experience in Medicaid planning to answer this specific question. Better safe than sorry!
I cannot agree more with Elfgarden! See an elder care attorney ASAP regarding your circumstances. It will be money well spent and save you much worry and anxiety that you have done the right thing regarding your estates future benefits to your loved ones.
The only situation that I know where the house could be transfered without penalty, is if son had been live-in caregiver for dad, it was necessary according to his doctor, and for a minimum period of two years.
I agree with all of the above, see an elder law attorney that specializes in Medicaid planning asap!
Do not - I repeat do NOT apply for Medicaid until you contact an experienced Elderlaw/Medicaid attorney. The Medicaid laws have changed drastically. It used to be that penalties for gifts (including transfers) were calculated at the date of the transfer whereas they are now calculated at the date you apply for Medicaid. Big difference. Applying too soon could make you ineligible for many more years whereas if you wait out the penalty period, you should be eligible if all other criteria is met. Research this point to see if it applies to your situation and then pay for a consultation with the best Elderlaw attorney you can find. Money well spent!
If you "gave" the house to your son at less than market value within the 5 year look-back period, its value will be considered a gift. I don't think there is any prorating based on how long ago it was given.
By proceeding, I agree that I understand the following disclosures:
I. How We Work in Washington.
Based on your preferences, we provide you with information about one or more of our contracted senior living providers ("Participating Communities") and provide your Senior Living Care Information to Participating Communities. The Participating Communities may contact you directly regarding their services.
APFM does not endorse or recommend any provider. It is your sole responsibility to select the appropriate care for yourself or your loved one. We work with both you and the Participating Communities in your search. We do not permit our Advisors to have an ownership interest in Participating Communities.
II. How We Are Paid.
We do not charge you any fee – we are paid by the Participating Communities. Some Participating Communities pay us a percentage of the first month's standard rate for the rent and care services you select. We invoice these fees after the senior moves in.
III. When We Tour.
APFM tours certain Participating Communities in Washington (typically more in metropolitan areas than in rural areas.) During the 12 month period prior to December 31, 2017, we toured 86.2% of Participating Communities with capacity for 20 or more residents.
IV. No Obligation or Commitment.
You have no obligation to use or to continue to use our services. Because you pay no fee to us, you will never need to ask for a refund.
V. Complaints.
Please contact our Family Feedback Line at (866) 584-7340 or ConsumerFeedback@aplaceformom.com to report any complaint. Consumers have many avenues to address a dispute with any referral service company, including the right to file a complaint with the Attorney General's office at: Consumer Protection Division, 800 5th Avenue, Ste. 2000, Seattle, 98104 or 800-551-4636.
VI. No Waiver of Your Rights.
APFM does not (and may not) require or even ask consumers seeking senior housing or care services in Washington State to sign waivers of liability for losses of personal property or injury or to sign waivers of any rights established under law.
I agree that:
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I authorize A Place For Mom ("APFM") to collect certain personal and contact detail information, as well as relevant health care information about me or from me about the senior family member or relative I am assisting ("Senior Living Care Information").
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APFM may provide information to me electronically. My electronic signature on agreements and documents has the same effect as if I signed them in ink.
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APFM may send all communications to me electronically via e-mail or by access to an APFM web site.
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You consent to APFM's reaching out to you using a phone system than can auto-dial numbers (we miss rotary phones, too!), but this consent is not required to use our service.
Another option to educate yourself before meeting with any firm is to call a local office of long term medicaid & ask how to obtain a blank application. Get at least 2 copies of the blank app. Look over it carefully yourself. Make calls for answers about the sections of the app, educate yourself about how YOU would fill it out. Then take in a rough draft you have filled out to a local advocacy office, like DADS in TX or senior source. Anywhere there is a benefits counselor. Sometimes the benefits counselor for free will know more than the lawyer.
If there was any way on God's green earth, that I could keep my father out of a NH for one more year, I would do it.....seek all options and run to see and Elder Law Attorney.
Good Luck and God Bless!
Under pre-DRA (the Medicaid law change effective in 2006) law, the penalty did indeed go down each passing month starting with the date of the gift, but under current law it does not.
And, I agree with Elfgarden. Seek out the advice of an elder law attorney.
I agree with all of the above, see an elder law attorney that specializes in Medicaid planning asap!