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I. How We Work in Washington. Based on your preferences, we provide you with information about one or more of our contracted senior living providers ("Participating Communities") and provide your Senior Living Care Information to Participating Communities. The Participating Communities may contact you directly regarding their services. APFM does not endorse or recommend any provider. It is your sole responsibility to select the appropriate care for yourself or your loved one. We work with both you and the Participating Communities in your search. We do not permit our Advisors to have an ownership interest in Participating Communities.
II. How We Are Paid. We do not charge you any fee – we are paid by the Participating Communities. Some Participating Communities pay us a percentage of the first month's standard rate for the rent and care services you select. We invoice these fees after the senior moves in.
III. When We Tour. APFM tours certain Participating Communities in Washington (typically more in metropolitan areas than in rural areas.) During the 12 month period prior to December 31, 2017, we toured 86.2% of Participating Communities with capacity for 20 or more residents.
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V. Complaints. Please contact our Family Feedback Line at (866) 584-7340 or ConsumerFeedback@aplaceformom.com to report any complaint. Consumers have many avenues to address a dispute with any referral service company, including the right to file a complaint with the Attorney General's office at: Consumer Protection Division, 800 5th Avenue, Ste. 2000, Seattle, 98104 or 800-551-4636.
VI. No Waiver of Your Rights. APFM does not (and may not) require or even ask consumers seeking senior housing or care services in Washington State to sign waivers of liability for losses of personal property or injury or to sign waivers of any rights established under law.I agree that: A.I authorize A Place For Mom ("APFM") to collect certain personal and contact detail information, as well as relevant health care information about me or from me about the senior family member or relative I am assisting ("Senior Living Care Information"). B.APFM may provide information to me electronically. My electronic signature on agreements and documents has the same effect as if I signed them in ink. C.APFM may send all communications to me electronically via e-mail or by access to an APFM web site. D.If I want a paper copy, I can print a copy of the Disclosures or download the Disclosures for my records. E.This E-Sign Acknowledgement and Authorization applies to these Disclosures and all future Disclosures related to APFM's services, unless I revoke my authorization. You may revoke this authorization in writing at any time (except where we have already disclosed information before receiving your revocation.) This authorization will expire after one year. F.You consent to APFM's reaching out to you using a phone system than can auto-dial numbers (we miss rotary phones, too!), but this consent is not required to use our service.
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If within the next 5 years he needs to use Medicaid, can the adult children reimburse the proceeds acquired from the house, or does he have to keep the funds for 5 years?
I would not trust anyone to have funds that were gifted five years ago. He could have a massive stroke or heart attack tomorrow and NEED nursing home care. Then what?
If you want to take a chance that he can outlast the five year look-back period, then he needs to gift the proceeds now. They can't "force" the recipients to give back the money, but if Dad needs Medicaid before the five years are up, then he will not be eligible for a period of time equal to the total amount of the gift divided by the average cost of nursing home care for your state. Each state has a different amount. So, if Dad gifts $100,000 and the average cost of NH care in his state is $5,000 a month, then he will not be able to have Medicaid pay for anything for twenty months.
The five year period is not pro-rated. So, if Dad needs Medicaid, and 58 of the 60 months have passed, the penalty is the same as if one month has passed.
You are not understanding the five year look back period, and there has been discussions about increasing the five years to seven. If the gift were made today, and dad needed nursing home in four years and 364 days he would be penalized for the gifts in an amount equal to those gifts where his care would have to be paid out of someone's pocket until the entire gift amount is spent for his care. Then he could reapply for Medicaid.
Cabridie, let your Dad know how much it could cost him if he were to go into Independent Living, Assisted Living, Assisted Living/Memory Care, or into long-term-care [nursing home]. Cost per month could be $5k to $15k. Yes, per month !!
I know I was like a deer in headlight when I first learned the cost of each. Thank goodness my parents saved for a "rainy day" as at one time it was pouring out there with my Mom in long-term-care, and with Dad having caregivers around the clock at home, it was costing my parents $34,000 per month for their care. YIKES !!
Eventually my Dad sold the house after Mom passed [he was hoping she would come home, but that wasn't in the cards for her] and used the equity for his care. Whatever was left over was given however his Will was written. I know I was always worried about Dad running out of money and needing to apply for Medicaid. Since I was POA I kept 3-ring binders on all of Dad's bills and a copy of the checks from his account, just in case he needed Medicaid.
Now if your Dad sells his house now, where will be live? Will he downsize into something easier to manage? I know my Dad couldn't wait to move from his house being in his 90's as maintaining the house was too much for him. He was happy as a clam living in Independent Living, said he felt like a King there :)
As I understand it, that would be considered a gift when applying for Medicaid and would result in not qualifying for x days. During that penalty period the three of you could private pay for his care until he is eligible for Medicaid.
He can give it to his children. Their best bet is then to bank it and not touch it for five years, unless they're already so rich that if he needs care before the five-year period is up they will be able to fund it for him.
If he keeps the money he will need to work his way through it before he can apply for Medicaid, though.
Are you confident that your father has all the information he needs to come to a practical decision about this? If he's expecting to sell the house and realise a substantial sum of money, perhaps it would be best to get a reputable financial adviser to have a look at his plans overall.
By proceeding, I agree that I understand the following disclosures:
I. How We Work in Washington.
Based on your preferences, we provide you with information about one or more of our contracted senior living providers ("Participating Communities") and provide your Senior Living Care Information to Participating Communities. The Participating Communities may contact you directly regarding their services.
APFM does not endorse or recommend any provider. It is your sole responsibility to select the appropriate care for yourself or your loved one. We work with both you and the Participating Communities in your search. We do not permit our Advisors to have an ownership interest in Participating Communities.
II. How We Are Paid.
We do not charge you any fee – we are paid by the Participating Communities. Some Participating Communities pay us a percentage of the first month's standard rate for the rent and care services you select. We invoice these fees after the senior moves in.
III. When We Tour.
APFM tours certain Participating Communities in Washington (typically more in metropolitan areas than in rural areas.) During the 12 month period prior to December 31, 2017, we toured 86.2% of Participating Communities with capacity for 20 or more residents.
IV. No Obligation or Commitment.
You have no obligation to use or to continue to use our services. Because you pay no fee to us, you will never need to ask for a refund.
V. Complaints.
Please contact our Family Feedback Line at (866) 584-7340 or ConsumerFeedback@aplaceformom.com to report any complaint. Consumers have many avenues to address a dispute with any referral service company, including the right to file a complaint with the Attorney General's office at: Consumer Protection Division, 800 5th Avenue, Ste. 2000, Seattle, 98104 or 800-551-4636.
VI. No Waiver of Your Rights.
APFM does not (and may not) require or even ask consumers seeking senior housing or care services in Washington State to sign waivers of liability for losses of personal property or injury or to sign waivers of any rights established under law.
I agree that:
A.
I authorize A Place For Mom ("APFM") to collect certain personal and contact detail information, as well as relevant health care information about me or from me about the senior family member or relative I am assisting ("Senior Living Care Information").
B.
APFM may provide information to me electronically. My electronic signature on agreements and documents has the same effect as if I signed them in ink.
C.
APFM may send all communications to me electronically via e-mail or by access to an APFM web site.
D.
If I want a paper copy, I can print a copy of the Disclosures or download the Disclosures for my records.
E.
This E-Sign Acknowledgement and Authorization applies to these Disclosures and all future Disclosures related to APFM's services, unless I revoke my authorization. You may revoke this authorization in writing at any time (except where we have already disclosed information before receiving your revocation.) This authorization will expire after one year.
F.
You consent to APFM's reaching out to you using a phone system than can auto-dial numbers (we miss rotary phones, too!), but this consent is not required to use our service.
The five year period is not pro-rated. So, if Dad needs Medicaid, and 58 of the 60 months have passed, the penalty is the same as if one month has passed.
I know I was like a deer in headlight when I first learned the cost of each. Thank goodness my parents saved for a "rainy day" as at one time it was pouring out there with my Mom in long-term-care, and with Dad having caregivers around the clock at home, it was costing my parents $34,000 per month for their care. YIKES !!
Eventually my Dad sold the house after Mom passed [he was hoping she would come home, but that wasn't in the cards for her] and used the equity for his care. Whatever was left over was given however his Will was written. I know I was always worried about Dad running out of money and needing to apply for Medicaid. Since I was POA I kept 3-ring binders on all of Dad's bills and a copy of the checks from his account, just in case he needed Medicaid.
Now if your Dad sells his house now, where will be live? Will he downsize into something easier to manage? I know my Dad couldn't wait to move from his house being in his 90's as maintaining the house was too much for him. He was happy as a clam living in Independent Living, said he felt like a King there :)
How is your dad's health now?
No, he has to keep the funds until he dies unless he uses it for his own care before then.
If he keeps the money he will need to work his way through it before he can apply for Medicaid, though.
Are you confident that your father has all the information he needs to come to a practical decision about this? If he's expecting to sell the house and realise a substantial sum of money, perhaps it would be best to get a reputable financial adviser to have a look at his plans overall.